Tired of the Spotlight

Starbucks has never really been "Pro-Gun," they just have never been "Anti-Gun" either.  They've tried to remain neutral on the whole issue, simply stating they would follow local laws regarding open-carry of firearms.

Over the years their stores have been used as a meeting place and have unwantingly hosted rallies and open carry displays, along with anti-gun protesters loudly crying about their stance, or lack thereof.

They have once again made a noncommittal request for gun owners to not openly display firearms in their stores (but if you do, we'll still serve you... just try not to, ok?)

I can't say I blame them, they've spent a few years under somewhat intense scrutiny from the Antis, and an unwanted embrace from the Pros; all because they have tried their hardest to not pick sides.

Madison 5 Awarded $10,000 Judgement Against City of Madison/Madison PD

For immediate release:

On September 18, 2010 five law abiding Wisconsin residents were peacefully
having dinner at a Culver's Restaurant in Madison, Wisconsin. These 5
individuals, who were legally openly carrying as provided by Wisconsin law had
finished their dinner and were preparing to leave the restaurant when they were
unlawfully detained by a mass of Madison police officers.

Despite the absence of reasonable suspicion or probable cause of any crime or
violation, Madison police illegally demanded identification from the men under
the threat of arrest if they did not comply. 2 individuals who chose not to
comply with the illegal action of the Madison police were subsequently arrested
and cited for obstruction. 2 days later those unlawfully issued citations were
rescinded and all 5 men, even those who complied with the officers illegal
demands were issued citations for disorderly conduct.

On May 5th of 2011, the frivolous disorderly conduct charges against all 5 men
were dropped.

Wisconsin Carry, Inc. a non-profit corporation dedicated to protecting and
advancing the right of Wisconsinites to carry in the manner of their choosing,
open or concealed, filed a federal lawsuit against the City of Madison and the 5
Madison Police officers who participated in the unlawful detainment and
treatment of these 5 individuals. A copy of that lawsuit is available here:

http://www.wisconsincarry.org/pdf/Madison5/lawsuit.pdf

Today a judgment of $10,000 against the City of Madison and 5 Madison police
offers was agreed to by Wisconsin Carry, Inc. and our 5 co-plaintiffs. This
judgment will be entered into the record of the Federal District Court, Western
Wisconsin.

A copy of the judgment agreement can be viewed here:

http://www.wisconsincarry.org/pdf/Madison5/Doc_10_Acceptance_of_OOJ.pdf

Wisconsin Carry will continue to employ and "all of the above" approach to advancing and protecting the right to carry in the manner of one's choosing in Wisconsin. Included in those methods are lawsuits, grass roots legislative activism, public education/awareness, free concealed weapon license training, and every other effective measure.


Carry On,

Nik Clark
Chairman/President - Wisconsin Carry, Inc.
www.wisconsincarry.org
nik@wisconsincarry.org
www.facebook.com/groups/wisconsincarry
www.youtube.com/wisconsincarry
www.twitter.com/wisconsincarry

Like Weeds...

They're popping up everywhere.

I'm still waiting for my permit, but the list of places I'll no longer be going is getting bigger everyday. It's their right as a business owner, but that doesn't mean I have to like it (and it's a shame in some places, that steak Applebee's gave me Friday was really good.

I am wondering why many of these places waited until concealed carry to post though, and not after the surge in Open Carry a couple years ago? I guess if you can't see it, you can't ask them to leave and claim "it's making other customers uneasy."

More on Mill's Fleet Farm

Yesterday I confirmed that Mill's Fleet Farm (not to be confused with Blane's Farm & Fleet) will be carrying handguns in the next month or so.  I also said I'd expand on why I'm more than a little excited about this.

Mill's Fleet Farm is primarily a farm supply store, however they do stock quite a bit of household goods, clothing, and outdoor recreation stuff, primarily hunting and fishing.  It's kind of like taking a Tractor Supply and mixing it with Walmart, so while they do have camping stuff, it's not the high end stuff you'd find at even Gander Mountain or a similar purely outdoors store.

Fleet Farm has always been more gun friendly than similar stores (Blane's Farm & Fleet expressly prohibits Open Carry in their stores, where Mill's Fleet Farm welcomes it.)  Their prices have never been anything all that special, but they've generally got the largest selection of ammunition in town, and a fairly decent offering of long guns.  They also have an isle full of Military Surplus items, and in the last year have started carrying factory Remington 870 mag extensions and a Midwest Industries AR Carbine sized rail system.  Handguns really aren't that much of a stretch.

Why I'm surprised is that while it's not a big chain (Mostly just Wisconsin and a few neighboring states) it's still a corporate-ish chain store.  Given that within the last year or so some Walmart locations stopped carrying handgun ammo, or firearms all-together, for "image" reasons (they have recently decided to turn around on that decision.  I guess the sales numbers spoke) I am pleasantly surprised to see another chain/big-box type store taking a step in the other direction.

It's not that far of a stretch though.  As I've said, Fleet Farm has traditionally been gun-friendly anyway, and while I can't speak for other locations, the Stevens Point, WI location is poised to fill a decade long, county-wide void in the market (currently the nearest dealer that regularly stocks handguns is a 40+ mile drive down the interstate in the next county north of us.)  Also, it's looking like Wisconsin will have CCW legislation of some sort (Constitutional or Shall-issue) by October, and demand for handguns will increase.  Capitalism at its best.

It's a smart business move, and is probably giving the PR rep an aneurysm.  Personally, I'm mostly happy to only have to drive across town to drool over handguns rather than to the next county.

June 5th Non-Event

Breda and a few others are planning an OC non-event for Sunday, June 5th.  The idea is to do what some of us do everyday, and that is to go about doing your daily business with an openly carried firearm (local laws apply.)

Sounds About Right

Breda OC'ed in public... and the usual happened.

NRA Workshop AAR/WI CCW Bills Info

Last Thursday the NRA-ILA, in conjunction with Wisconsin Force, put on a "Grassroots Workshop" at Gander Mountain.  Due to CCW legislation being recently introduced into the state house and senate, and a public hearing regarding these bills taking place across town from the meeting earlier in the day, the "workshop" turned into more of a CCW Bill familiarization class.

First off though, the turnout was great.  There was at least 100 people cramming into a room meant for about 40.

Yay, crappy cell pic!

We were literally overflowing into the store.  The upside was that they mic'd the speakers, so the entire store could hear what was being said.

As far as the bills in circulation, there are three: AB126/SB90 (shall carry/licensed carry) and SB93 (Constitutional Carry.)  The NRA guys claim they support both.  While this seems a bit strange at first, what they mean is that they'd love to see both bills reconciled and combined.  Realistically, this would be a bit rough, but I tend to agree with their thought process.

It's pretty long, so more after the break-

Texas Readers-

Aaron at Weapon Blog is asking you contact your elected officials regarding HB 2756 (Open Carry).

Charges Dropped Against Madison 5

For immediate release: 

Last fall five Wisconsin Carry members were peacefully enjoying dinner at a Madison area Culvers restaurant. Like thousands of Wisconsin residents, they carry a sidearm for self-defense as a daily practice in the only manner currently provided by Wisconsin law. After a 911 caller inquired as to the legality of open-carry, Madison police arrived en masse and illegally demanded identification from all five. Two members who politely declined to provide ID were wrongfully cited for obstruction of justice. (Wisconsin, a free state, does not require you produce identification when you have done nothing wrong.) Those citations were rescinded 2 days later and all 5 were mailed citations for disorderly conduct despite no evidence of a disturbance. Details of that initial incident are available on Wisconsin Carry's websitewww.wisconsincarry.org. Click on the "Sept. 23rd 2010" blog heading for details including the audio of the 911 call. 

Wisconsin Carry filed a federal civil lawsuit against the City of Madison and Police Chief Noble Wray on September 29, 2010. That lawsuit can be viewed here: http://www.wisconsincarry.org/pdf/Ma...nComplaint.pdf

Wisconsin Carry also retained, on behalf of our members, notable defense attorney Chris Van Wagner, principal of the Madison law firm Van Wagner & Wood http://www.vanwagnerwood.com/ to contest the wrongfully issued disorderly conduct citations. 

Today, Wisconsin Carry is pleased to announce that Attorney Van Wagner has informed us that all of the charges against the "Madison 5" have been dismissed. According to Attorney Van Wagner "The Madison City Attorney agreed after a full review of the police investigation and 911 call that there was absolutely no disturbance created by our members and that the disorderly conduct citations were inappropriate". Van Wagner also added that "The ONLY disturbance created on that Saturday evening was by a mass of uniformed Madison police officers and squads arriving to investigate law-abiding citizens having dinner" 

Questions about this incident and subsequent actions by Wisconsin Carry and our attorney may be directed to Wisconsin Carry or Attorney Chris Van Wagner. Wisconsin Carry will shortly be filing a second civil lawsuit against Madison Police Chief Noble Wray and the City of Madison to obtain damages on behalf of our members for their wrongful detainment and costs associated with disposing of the citations. 

Wisconsin Carry, Inc. is a non-profit organization dedicated to the preservation and advancement of the ability of law-abiding Wisconsin residents to legally carry in the manner of their choosing (open or concealed). 

Carry On, 
Nik Clark Chairman/President - Wisconsin Carry, Inc. nik@wisconsincarry.org www.wisconsincarry.org

 (bold emphasis mine)

This is good news indeed.

OC Works

"I was observing the yoot as he followed us. He was close to bad breath distance, and observed Unc's openly carried Glock 30. He then noticed my Smith & Wesson J-frame, also openly carried, and that's when he veered off sharply and started walking at a pace that could be described as "brisk", except that the rate at which he left us would make "brisk" seem like a slow amble..."

It's not just a political statement.

Raven Concealment, Take 2

So I've had enough time to get the feel for the new Raven Phantom I got for the M&P9, a and a couple range trips to give it a good shake down.  The giddy, childlike "new toy" excitement has worn off, but it has been replaced with plenty of contentment.

Originally I thought the extra controls and lumpy bits on the side of the M&P were what gave this holster a much more secure feeling, however upon further inspection, I found Raven has added a small dimple to the light area of the holster.

This little dimple creates a small catch right behind the light's bezel, and makes this holster feel about 3,000 times more secure than the old one for the SigPro.  I guess I wasn't the only one who wished for more retention on the light models.

Also, there had been reports of older Raven products cracking, and to help Raven switched to a thicker Kydex for their holsters.

I have a feeling this additional stiffness is also a bit responsible for the more secure feeling.  I hear that they can still make them with the thinner Kydex if you're worried about concealment issues with the thicker material, however I don't think the difference is enough to matter.

As I mentioned in the past, the old style "paddle clips" were not the most comfortable option, and I also had one break on me.  The old style clips are a thing of the past now, and Raven has switched to an OWB Soft Loop snap system.

I much prefer these to the old "paddle clips" and to any other actual paddles I've used in the past.  The gun sticks out much less, and while concealment isn't a worry for me yet, it's nice to not have it sticking out and catching on things.  They may take a couple seconds longer to put on or take off the belt, but they feel quite secure and keep the whole thing from flopping around nicely with the right belt.  In this case, a 5.11 re-enforced model that came free with some pants. It's a little big (I wear it on the smallest hole...) but looks good and is holding up well, and the price was right.

The loops themselves are made of a tough rubberized material and Military-grade snaps, and is adjustable for belt width.  I expect these to hold up for quite a while.

Raven has also changed the material of their standard belt loops from formed Kydex to an injection molded plastic.

Less prone to breakage, and also universal.  The old ones had distinct left and right loops.  The little Raven logos are a nice touch.  (Also, the new mag pouch is the same thickness Kydex as the old.  While it makes a great range pouch, it's not what I've been running for daily carry however.  I have a much more comfortable option I'll mention in a couple days.)

As some of you may know, I live in Wisconsin, so concealment has never been high on the list of things I look for with a holster.  The biggest reason I went with RCS was that they make a holster that holds my gun with my light attached.  I've done enough low light/no light training to greatly appreciate a white light on my gun if I have that option (and yes, I think one day of it was enough to appreciate it.  However more is needed to affectively use it.)

I know that plenty of the people looking at these are worried about concealing, so I tossed on a good cover garment and snapped a few pictures.  In this case, a button up cotton shirt with a textured weave.  ($15 at Khol's and the girlfriend says it looks good too!)

Not bad for a full size gun with an attached light.  Granted, if I lift my hands above my head the bottom of the holster is exposed, but I could adjust the soft loops to make the holster ride higher.

So, are there any downsides to RCS's stuff?  Well, I ordered this one the first week of November 2010, and it finally was in my hands mid-March 2011.  It also wasn't cheap, holster, mag pouch, and soft loops plus shipping came out to around $130.  Compare that to Comp-Tac, who I ordered a new holster for a gun I should be getting next week on Tuesday, and the package was dropped off at the post office yesterday(and it's red!)  Too bad they don't make light holsters...

Bottom line - if you're looking for a quality Kydex holster, with great modularity and carry options, especially if you carry with a light, and are willing to wait a few months; Raven Concealment Systems is worth taking a look at.

NRA Grassroots Workshops

The NRA is holding some workshops/meetings to discuss the pending CCW legislation in WI-

For Concealed Carry To Become a Reality, NRA Needs Your Help!


Attend FREE Workshop and Help secure the Right-to-Carry Concealed. It’s time for Wisconsin to join free America!

Dear Wisconsin NRA Member:

During last November’s elections, NRA members and gun owners throughout the Badger State sent a clear message to elected officials that a strong Right-to-Carry law must be a legislative priority. Residents of Wisconsin sent their legislators to Madison to secure their freedom.

To ensure we are prepared to meet the challenges posed by anti-gun forces and answer questions our members have about this legislation, NRA-ILA Grassroots will be hosting a series of workshops throughout the state. Please plan on attending to learn more about the bills, as well as what you need to do as gun-owners to assist in our efforts.

At this meeting, NRA-ILA Staff will discuss the bills, as well as what each of you need to do to ensure victory. NRA State and Local Lobbyist Darren La Sorte will be on hand along with NRA-ILA Grassroots Staff to lead the workshop.

This meeting is absolutely free and beverages and light snacks will be provided. The workshop will run about 60-90 minutes. Please make plans to attend one of our events and encourage your fellow NRA members and Second Amendment supporters to attend as well.

Here are the details for the upcoming workshops:

Eau Claire
Tuesday, May 10th
6:30p.m.
Gander Mountain
6440 Sculy Drive
Eau Claire,WI 54701
(715) 834-4594
http://nraila.org/workshops/Register.aspx?ID=eauclaire2011

Milwaukee (Richfield)
Wednesday, May 11th
6:30p.m.
Cabela’s
One Cabela Way
Richfield, WI 53076
262-628-5700
http://nraila.org/workshops/Register.aspx?ID=Richfield2011

Wausau (Rothschild)
Thursday, May 12th
Gander Mountain
6:30p.m.
1560 County Road XX
Rothschild,WI 54474
(715) 355-5500
http://nraila.org/workshops/Register.aspx?ID=Rothschild2011

To register for this free event, please visit the link under the location closest to you above, or call the NRA-ILA Grassroots Division at (800) 392-VOTE (8683).

We look forward to seeing you!

Yours in freedom,
NRA Institute for Legislative Action

http://www.nraila.org/

I've registered for the Wausau(Rothschild) one, since it's closest, and pending a change in the work schedule, should be able to make it.

I'm going to assume that with Gander Mountain being an Open Carry Friendly business, that that should be ok as well.

It is working...

Even if it's a little slow, but as Uncle pointed out in a couple things today, OC is making somebody obviously carrying a handgun less of big deal and a bit more "normal."  As Sebastian notes:

if the folks who are engaging in attention seeking behavior now need to up the ante to rifles, because pistols just don’t grab attention like they used to, maybe there is something to the OC theory.

I'm still not going to go around town with a long gun though.  I've spent plenty of time lugging a rifle around 24/7, and it's a pain and more annoying than not if you rarely have to use it.

OC in the Snow

Hooray for somewhat awkward self shots!

I finally broke down and bought some actual "winter" boots (Colombia Bugaboot XTM), so I thought I'd got for a quick hike in my snowshoes.  The boots claim to be good down to -65F.  I'm not sure of that, but in the hour or so I was tromping through the snow in 15F, my feet stayed nice and warm. They've got a nice little ridge of rubber on the heel to keep your binding in place, and a D-ring on the toe to keep you gaiters from riding up (need to get some... tomorrow probably.)

Up till now I've been wearing some issue tan Gor-tex boots.  They still keep my feet nice and dry, but not as warm as I prefer.

Open Carry Victory

For Immediate Release:

On Sunday July 4th, 2010, a law abiding Wisconsin woman, who was open carrying
for personal protection during her daily activities, was illegally stopped and
taken from her vehicle at gunpoint by Brookfield Police Officers after she was
leaving a church service.

As open-carry is perfectly legal in Wisconsin and the officers were aware she (a
Wisconsin Carry member) had threatened no one and caused no disturbance, the
officers had no reasonable articulable suspicion (RAS) which the law requires,
to stop and detain our member against her will. In addition, by drawing their
guns on a law-abiding citizen who had done nothing wrong, the officers used an
unlawful threat of deadly force during their detainment of our member. The
police proceeded to, without reasonable suspicion or probable cause that any
crime had occurred, conduct an illegal and unconstitutional search of our
member's person and car. Our member was then unlawfully arrested and taken to
the Brookfield Police Department for processing.  No charges were ever filed.

On October 7th, 2010 Wisconsin Carry, Inc. filed a federal lawsuit against the
City of Brookfield and 4 officers involved in the illegal arrest/search of our
member.

A copy of that lawsuit can be viewed here:

http://www.wisconsincarry.org/pdf/Brookfield/Doc_1_Complaint.pdf

Today, on behalf of Wisconsin Carry's thousands of members, in every county, all
across the state, and law-abiding citizens who legally exercise their right to
carry in Wisconsin we are pleased to announce that a judgment of $7,500 has been
entered in United States District Court against The City of Brookfield.  A copy
of this judgment can be viewed here:

http://www.wisconsincarry.org/pdf/Brookfield/Doc_09_Offer_of_Judgment.pdf

http://www.wisconsincarry.org/pdf/Brookfield/Doc_12_Judgment.pdf

This $7,500 judgment against Brookfield follows a judgment of $10,000 that was
entered against The City of Racine for a similar unlawful arrest of one of our
members and subsequent lawsuit filed by Wisconsin Carry, Inc. in January of
2010. A copy of that judgment can be viewed here.

http://www.wisconsincarry.org/pdf/GFSZA_Legal_Documents/JudgmentAgainstRacine.pd
f

Wisconsin Carry, Inc. currently has pending federal lawsuits against The City of
Madison, Madison Police Chief Noble Wray, The City of Milwaukee, The City of
Manitowoc, and the City of Greenfield for actions that violate the
constitutional rights of law-abiding Wisconsin residents who exercise their
right to carry.  A copy of those lawsuits can be viewed here:

http://www.wisconsincarry.org/pdf/GFSZA_Legal_Documents/03_GFSZ_Complaint_A2.pdf

http://www.wisconsincarry.org/pdf/Madison/MadisonComplaint.pdf

Wisconsin Carry, Inc. is a non-profit corporation dedicated to the preservation
and reclamation of the rights of law-abiding Wisconsin residents to carry in the
manner of their choosing.  We believe that "open carry" and "concealed carry"
are choices to be made by law-abiding citizens based on their situation and
preference.  Wisconsin Carry, like many gun-rights organizations in Wisconsin,
is investing a great deal of resources to get Wisconsin law changed to allow
concealed carry this next legislative session by proposing Constitutional Carry.
Wisconsin Carry, Inc. will continue to use legal recourse to deter unlawful
treatment of law-abiding Wisconsin residents who currently exercise their right
to open carry, and soon will exercise their right to concealed carry in
Wisconsin.

Carry On,

Nik Clark
Chairman/President - Wisconsin Carry, Inc.

www.wisconsincarry.org

nik@wisconsincarry.org

Locked & Loaded

A pretty decent profile of an OCer down in Madison.  Decently researched and well written.

Of course PSH ensue.

 One thing for sure — let a few folks go nutso or a couple of gunfights erupt in a bar and you will see a rapid change in the public attitude toward weapons, concealed or open, and soon after laws would be changed.

Just like in those 48 other states that allow CCW...

(h/t to The Duck)

Holster Suggestions

So here's the challenge:

I need a holster for the Smith & Wesson M&P9 (full size) with a Streamlight TLR-1s, with some sort of retention (thumb break preferred) and preferably with a paddle-type attachment, or some other way to remove the holster without dropping my pants.  As I live in Wisconsin, concealment is not a concern at this point.  Material and color is secondary at this point, but brown or tan leather or kydex would be great.

I was looking at Blade-Tech's options, but it looks like the only light bearing holster they have for the M&P is with the no longer made Surefire X200 (which cost more than I want to spend on a white light anyway...) They do make one for my gun/light combo, but no retention.

Any suggestions?

Mandatory Waiting Periods

Are plain stupid.  Especially when you're obviously carrying one while you fill out the paperwork.

Just thought I'd put that out there...

WCI vs MPD

The suit has been filed, full email can be read after the jump (it's long)  A copy of the full suit can be read here.

Wisconsin Eye

WCI President Nik Clark and MPD Chief Noble Wray do some talking.

I can see why the Chief has his job, he seems like the touchy-feely kind of guy.  I guess if somebody calls you in for OCing in a shirt they think is ugly, you'll get nailed with a DC charge.

I'm also glad I'm not a member of M&I bank.  Not for the gun thing, but no hats? Really?